A Conversation with Yunjilink CEO Zhang Junbin: Understanding Human Nature, Bidding Farewell to Naivety 对话云鲸CEO张峻彬：理解人性，告别天真

Background

Zhang Junbin founded Yunjing with a passion for product development, which he pursued intensely for a decade. However, his self-described "gentle" and conflict-averse nature, coupled with a CEO's avoidance of operational complexity, led to a significant leadership gap. While he remained insulated in the product realm, the company suffered from internal inefficiencies: departmental silos, constant staff turnover in key roles, and the departure of experienced employees. These issues accumulated unchecked, culminating in a crisis that forced Zhang to confront his shortcomings as a leader.

Key Points

• The Leadership Awakening: Zhang identified his core fault: being a product enthusiast, not a CEO. His reluctance to engage with difficult operational and human resource issues allowed problems to fester. He acknowledged that saying "everything is fine" to avoid conflict was ultimately harmful, a failure to provide the firm direction a CEO must.
• Marketing as the Critical Failure: Stepping back from product, Zhang discovered marketing was a major bottleneck. He exposed fundamental disconnects in operational metrics (e.g., "sales operations" vs. "sales" accounting) and unscientific expense allocation, which masked poor performance and inefficiency. He reframed his understanding: business success is not "Product + Marketing" (additive) but "Product x Marketing" (multiplicative); a brilliant product fails if its marketing is a zero.
• The "Founder Mode" Intervention: To catalyze rapid change, especially after key personnel shifts, Zhang chose direct, hands-on management ("Founder Mode"). He reallocated his focus to roughly 30% marketing, 30% overall operations, and 30% product. This was not about micromanaging forever, but about providing visible leadership to stabilize morale and drive reform swiftly in a time of transition.
• Philosophy on People and Trust: His experience forced a deep reflection on human nature, summarized by the proverb: "For the hundred virtues, filial piety comes first; we judge by intent, not deeds. For the ten thousand vices, lust comes first; we judge by deeds, not intent." He now evaluates team members on:
  1. Motivation: The ultimate filter. He distinguishes between those who build careers, gather resources, or build a true business with the company.
  2. Five Key Traits for Leaders (using marketing as an example): Financial acumen, deep product knowledge, cost-effective execution ("doing big things with small money"), strong channel resources, and team-building skills.
  3. Institutional Vigilance: He instituted weekly operational reviews on core marketing metrics (efficiency, scale, revenue, profit) to create a systematic monitoring rhythm. However, he stresses that "systems are the bottom line, but judgment of people is the ceiling." No KPI can fully capture intent or character.
• Embracing the CEO's "Ruthless" Role: Zhang realized that a leader cannot seek to please everyone. "Do not let everyone be happy" became a key lesson. Effective change requires achieving consensus among key stakeholders by presenting clear, data-backed benefits (e.g., "a 1% drop in return rate boosts net profit by 0.5%"), not just issuing commands. Sometimes, making tough calls on people is unavoidable.

Significance

Zhang Junbin's journey is a classic case of a technical founder's painful but necessary maturation into a holistic business leader. It underscores that product excellence alone is insufficient for scaling a company; operational rigor, marketing effectiveness, and above all, strong leadership in managing people and culture are critical. His story highlights the transition from a passion-driven creator to a strategically ruthless executor who must navigate the "gray areas" of human motivation. The tangible results—restored revenue growth, improved profitability, and reduced anxiety—validate this difficult shift, proving that confronting internal decay and embracing the full scope of the CEO role is essential for a company's survival and growth.

背景与问题

张峻彬作为产品型创始人，长期将精力投入产品与研发，但因此疏于公司整体管理与对人的判断。这直接导致了云鲸内部部门内耗严重、核心员工流失、战略执行不力等问题。病灶在于“没有一个人能将公司从上到下拧成一根绳”，其个人温和、“优柔寡断”的性格底色，在需要果断决策的CEO岗位上成为了短板。公司的危机感在国补退潮后爆发，促使他必须走出舒适区。

核心内容

1. 从“加法”到“乘法”：营销认知的重构：张峻彬彻底颠覆了“产品+营销”的旧观念，认识到二者是**“产品×营销”的乘法关系**。他发现营销部门存在数据口径不统一（如“销运口径”与“销口径”）、费用摊销规则混乱等基础但致命的管理问题，导致经营数据失真、效率低下。他通过创始人模式亲自介入，用“第一性原理”梳理问题，推动营销改革。

2. “同欲”是关键：组织改革的逻辑：推动内部改革阻力巨大。他意识到，强行推行会引发抵触甚至暗中对抗。成功的关键在于解决“同欲”问题——必须向关键人员清晰阐明改革对集团的具体、量化的收益（如退货率下降直接带来净利润提升），以获得共识与支持。

3. 对人判断高于制度：管理哲学的深化：

   • 识人五维：他认为优秀的营销操盘手需兼具财务能力、产品理解、花小钱办大事的巧劲、渠道资源、带队能力。
   • 动机识别：在能力之上，动机更为重要。他警惕“刷履历”和“攒资源”型的人才，青睐真正“做事业”、与公司共成长的伙伴。
   • 制度与人性：制度（如每周经营会盯投放效率、规模、收入、利润）是必要的监控底线，但存在盲区。对人（尤其是核心岗位）的判断，才是管理的天花板，这是KPI和系统无法覆盖的。

意义与影响

1. 业务成效的显现：改革带来了直接回报。2026年前四个月，海外市场营收同比增长近50%；国内市场在营销费用减少的情况下，营收与毛利率实现增长，并扭转了线下业务亏损的局面。
2. 个人领导力的成熟：这是张峻彬创业十年来最深刻的成长。他被迫“凝望人性的深渊”，理解了人性的灰色地带，引用古语“万恶淫为首，论迹不论心”表明其判断标准的转变。他从一个只愿做喜欢之事的产品人，蜕变为一个必须理解人、判断人，并在必要时果断做出人事决定的“狠人”，深刻体会了“慈不掌兵”的内涵。
3. 创业者必经之路的缩影：张峻彬的经历